Stoppage Drill7 March , 2012 in Sailors, navies and the war at sea. lieutenant commander (royal navy) English translation: lieutenant commander (royal navy).. I think you'll find that American English is a simplified and bastardised (once again, "s" not "z") version of British English. (Not all of you, some of you had some insightful comments above; but the anally retentive chauvinists above know who they are). Left - tenant will eventually become archaic usage here. different parts of the English speaking world. YTQxMjE0ZGUzNjZjM2Q2NjVkY2FmZGM4NjJkNDdkNjYzZTQ1ZjJhNTQ5YmZh It only takes a minute to sign up. ZGI1YjZhNWRkZmVjZWJhMDhhOWIyZjRjOGZmNDY3ZmZhYjZmN2VkM2YwN2Nm -----END REPORT-----. Both [v] (also [f]) and [w] are labial soundsthat is, made with the lips. By the way I was a sub-lieutenant so did pay some attention to how to pronounce and especially how the captain pronounced it certainly never leftenant or lootenant. @BrianHooper Every member of the Royal Navy I've met (a considerable number, from a wide variety of branches) has pronounced it 'lef-tenant'. It is funny that you mentioned the way some American Southerners/Appalachians sound like they are speaking Elizabethan English. The OED has several early occurrences spelt with an f including the earliest, 1387, "leeftenaunt".http://oed.com/public/contactus/contact-us. Seems Ben was right on the Revolutionary War beint the dividing point of British and American pronunciation, but IMO, it's pronounced with the F or V sound because of the U/V being interchangable during that time. var fontstart = '' About time y'all brushed up on your Spanish!! merchant seaman serving under Naval Articles, Naval Officers and subjecting them to naval discipline (number of the form) Tindal. After the American Revolution, in order to differentiate themselves and pretend to be of higher class, the British began incorrectly pronouncing their R's. Believe Simon has `pronouced' / spelt it better than I did. & Americans need to stop hating on the French -- without Benny Franklin's requesting help from King Louis in 1775, there would be no USA. //-->, By In British slang, of which there is a great deal, the word loo refers to a toilet. dailyinfo[17]=' PLY/3566 Private Samuel ROBINSON H.M.S. Welcome to The Royal Navy Shop. MILITARY HISTORY, dailyinfo[3]=' 45 Gunner HAZURA SINGH 31st Mountain Battery Indian Mountain Artillery who died 03/03/1920 TEHRAN MEMORIAL Iranm ' Towards the end of a busy day, a hatchet-faced lady came in and after looking around, she looked down her nose and said Id like a savoy cabbage please.. c2lnbmF0dXJlIjoiOTY1ZWYxYjAzMzZiMTI2MDIyYThlMDg5YzE4OGRhY2Yy It sure engenders some puzzled looks, but they are often followed by an "ah-ha" nod. Pride which they soon recovered during the Napoleonic conflict. Development in operations and logistics. The typical Royal Navy Lieutenant salary is 51,652 per year. From Latin then, lieutenant literally means "place holder" and the military lieutenant acts on behalf ofor in place oftheir commanding officer. Powered by Invision Community, The West Africa squadron in the 1840s; naval medicine; First World War, especially in poetry, art and fiction, 6th Btn South Staffordshire Regiment, 46th (North Midland) Division, Liverpool Scottish Listen to Mr Fry here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7E-aoXLZGY and go away feeling very ashamed of yourselves. Historically, the lieutenants in a ship were ranked in accordance with seniority, with the most senior being termed the first lieutenant and acting as the second-in-command. "Orbita." Here's a link to the Revolutionary War Theory: http://www.livescience.com/33652-americans-brits-accents.html. It could be a cross between ua or er - finding it difficult to spell. Elizabethan pronunciation was rhotic (like American English) and actually sounds much closer to Northern Irish or Cornish than American Southern. If you really wanted to check, the Oxford English Dictionary staff might be able to advise. 14th Bde. devil rays jersey 2021; In the Royal Navy it isn't. Why exactly do the British say lieutenant as ''leftenant . and Gen. Hos. dailyinfo[14]=' 16511 Private Albert COLEMAN "D" Coy. Canada. In his world the word is pronounced li-you-tenant, combining the correct pronunciation of the word lieu with tenant. After the Battle of France, Blake was seconded to the Royal Air Force's Fighter Command due to a shortage . I have some 18th Century New England ancestors who were named "Zerviah, although much of the time the name shows up as "Zeruiah" (which is virtually impossible to pronounce). For a great example of Elizabethan Pronunciation (which, by the by, was used over 200 years BEFORE the RP non-rhotic pronunciation became popular) check out this youtube link here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPlpphT7n9s. In Spanish and Portuguese, they dropped the lieu [lugar], and kept teniente and tenente, respectively. The USN settled on "lieutenant commander" in 1862, and made it a distinct rank; the Royal Navy followed suit in March 1914. In the Royal Navy, the pronunciation used to be "L'tenant" but never "Lootenant". - lieutenancy - Lt. - sublieutenant - three-star - two-star Spanish: tenienta - teniente - alfrez - inspector de polica - subteniente In Lists: Police ranks (US), Military naval ranks (US), more. Thank the British for our language and New York, else we would be speaking Dutch in New Amsterdam (or however the Dutch spell it). NmFiZGIxNzIxNTJhN2I5YzM5NWNiMTI2MjVjMTQzZTdkYTIwNWExMjEzNjY2 My code is GPL licensed, can I issue a license to have my code be distributed in a specific MIT licensed project? dailyinfo[22]=' 25368 Quartermaster Serjeant Leonard Henry CADE Meritorious Service Medal 12th Coy. Irish Guards who died 18/03/1916 CALAIS SOUTHERN CEMETERY France ' Primary Menu. As the head tenant became richer he was able to pay for a knight to stand in lieu of him. English is a wonderful language with elastic properties and influences from Nordic, Germanic and Arabic languages, Latin and Greek (among others) which allow for great expression of things technical, poetic, spiritual and esoteric. On the grey/gray matter, it all depends on my mood, the a and the e are interchangeable, and I understand the phonetic spelling of how we write in the US, like manoeuvre/maneuver, What are the 4 major sources of law in Zimbabwe? Reason for different pronunciations of "lieutenant", We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Deciphering two words from their Archaic spellings. YzJhODAzODZjNDA1OTNmMjQxYmVjZTlmYzI2Yzk4MDk5ZTMyODRjOGRhZjYy NWEzNjA5OGIwZDA4MDk1MzliMTE3N2YwNjNjZDVhYjM5MTBmNjljNzQ3Y2Zm or LIEF a. There is one common abbreviation for the word lieutenant: Lt. Apply for a career in The Royal Canadian Navy Apply Now The politicians and the public wanted nothing that sounded French. Are you making these common mistakes while drinking water? The Royal Navy itself has a history and naval tradition that stretches back over six centuries, making it one of the oldest institutions currently in existence. Learn about the American Navy and your career opportunities within the U.S. Armed Forces. What am I doing wrong here in the PlotLegends specification? This naval lieutenant ranks higher than an army lieutenants; within NATO countries the naval rank of lieutenant is a OF-2 and is the equivalent rank of an army captain. As to the original "leftenent" issue, the commonly accepted explanation is the u/v Old French connection, however, even though it is the accepted explanation, there seems to be some uncertainty as to the truth of this theory. lieu as the first element of a compound was sometimes apprehended by Englishmen as a v or f. Possibly some of the forms may be due to association with LEAVE sb. Instead, I found 20 or so different answers! Personally, I think that regardless of the tradition, the simple lack of a letter F should mean that you don't pronounce it "left-tenant". The Norman French phrase 'lieutenant' may have predated the Latin rendering 'locum tenens'. Synonyms: officer, army officer, navy officer, police officer US, more. :). ZjQ4ZDNiYjFjOTE0MWYyYzhkYTdhNGZjNTc3Y2IyYjIwM2M0MjAwZDNjNTQx OGRjNTY2MGZmNzY5MjBiNTFhMGUyYTE0YWZiNTEwYjBhOTBmYTBhYzJhZjM4 NmVmM2M1M2I3YmE1YjBiNjQ5ZTg3NDM0NzI4YzkyY2U0YjlhOWE3ZDEyIiwi . Maybe Russian and British English got the word through German, which regularly changes the 'u/w' sound to the 'v' sound; whereas we Americans took the pronunciation directly from French? How To Pronounce Lieutenant (Royal Navy) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (Senior Grade) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (Star Trek) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (U.S. Navy) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (U.S.) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (United States) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (United States) (disambiguation) How To Pronounce Lieutenant (US Navy) Royal Horse Artillery who died 16/03/1917 VARENNES MILITARY CEMETERY France ' The 'Leftenant' pronunciation appears to stem from Middle French which both had very different pronunciations to Modern French (like English) and the French-speaking elite in England definitely spoke very differently to those in France - we know this was a source of some mockery in the Middle Ages. Not too sure about the pronounciation in WW1, but I can give it as we used it in Naval School 1940-1952. If the Lieutenant was killed, the Left Tenant took the sword and became the Lieutenant. YzgwZjg2NDUyYjE0NDdhYWUzZDE5NGQ2MjJjNzJkMmNiZTA1MjJiMTI5NmE2 In 1677, Samuel Pepys, while he was Chief Secretary to the Admiralty, introduced the first examination for lieutenant,[2] and thereafter their seniority was dated from the passing of this examination. As a language it is spoken throughout the world, which helps everyone. if (month<10) month="0"+month Please see note on my profile.The project is currently dormant. This pattern was copied by the United States Navy, the United States Coast Guard, United States Public Health Service (USPHS) Commissioned Corps the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration Commissioned Officer Corps (NOAA Corps), and various air forces (primarily those of the United Kingdom, British Commonwealth, and nations formerly aligned with the Crown) for their equivalent ranks and grades, except that the executive curl is removed (see flight lieutenant). Shayn M. MmIyNDY4NmM0NWU1MzhhMzQwZmVmZGMxNTgwMTZlOTU0MWFmOGE2NzZiYTdj "The first reference to a naval Lieutenant is in 1580 when one was borne in each ship as the Captain's understudy. I don't understand all the nasty comments. Lieutenant [1] ( Lt; French: Lieutenant, lt) is a Canadian Forces rank used by commissioned officers of the Canadian Army or Royal Canadian Air Force. 26 More answers below In pronouncing the word "military", why do Americans say "MILL-uh-tarry" while the English say "MILL-uh-tree"? With that said, my best assumption would be the translation from French is the most likely reason for the difference in pronunciations. Last week I attended a lecture on strategy at the Royal United Services Institute, given by Major-General Mungo Melvin (whose book on Field Marshal Erich von Manstein is one of the best books you . Thereafter his designate was known as the "leftenant". if (year < 1000) year+=1900 You make a good point about the whole 'loo' part of it. dailyinfo[24]=' Captain Denzil Robert THURSTON Air Force Cross Airship Training Wing (Cranwell). What was new to me, on checking lieutenant, was the appearance of the f spelling (presumably indicating pronunciation), so early in the English version. [citation needed], In the Royal Navy, promotion to lieutenant is done in line with seniority. He must be a right-winger trying to create a false historical reality. A newspaper quot. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. OWUyNjU2OTQ5NGYyZmYwOGZmZDYyNTQyNGM3NzViYmQyNjJjMWMwZjBhZTk2 Lincolnshire Regiment who died 05/03/1916 CITE BONJEAN MILITARY CEMETERY, ARMENTIERES France ' Royal Marine Light Infantry who died 17/03/1918 BELLAVISTA OLD BRITISH CEMETERY Peru ' Because it's our language, and we can say it any way we like. We're not all narrow-minded fools. @ben E-mail : share.unit@nblbd.com, Useful Link Site | Disclosure on Risk Based Capital (Basel-III) | Code of Conduct (NBL) | Code of Conduct (Bangladesh Bank) | Bank Note Security Fea [1] The rank of Engineer Lieutenant-Commander replaced Engineer Lieutenant (Senior List) in 1914. 2nd Bn. Using Kolmogorov complexity to measure difficulty of problems? dailyinfo[6]=' 345190 Sapper Forrest A. KNOWLES Canadian Signal Corps who died 06/03/1921 REIDS MILLS CEMETERY Canada ' Commander I read somewhere that the RN switched to 'left' because it became too difficult to persuade new recruits, used to hearing 'left' in war films about the British Army, to use 'let.'. dailyinfo[13]=' 37643 Sapper Thomas John ECCLESTON Tunnelling Coy. I think the people addressing the old U and V issue are on the right track, however I think a better explanation is that in old french, lieu was spelled luef. In the United States, contingent on the type of uniform worn, U.S. Navy, U.S. Coast Guard, USPHS Commissioned Corps, and NOAA Corps lieutenants also wear pin-on metal collar, shoulder, or headgear insignia, or cloth shoulder, collar, tabbed, or headgear insignia identical to that of a United States Marine Corps captain and similar to that of a United States Army, United States Air Force, or United States Space Force captain. [TMP] "Leftenant or Lootenant?" Topic . lent to Royal Canadian Navy at Halifax, NS [HMCS Stadacona?] ZTk3YzRlZTJjMjg2NmYzMmIyZTE5NTQ3Mzc1NjA1YTMwNGE3ZmNhZTg1ZDdi From at least 1580,[1] the lieutenant on a ship had been the officer immediately subordinate to the captain. I'm still not sure how on earth to pronounce it (even though I've had that "American Speech" article I quoted from for five years now). eyJtZXNzYWdlIjoiYWI0NjU5MTI5OWU1ZmVmYzM1NWQ2Y2M3ZmJjYmU0OTE3 Americans changed it to fit their own odd version of a perfect language. During the early days of the naval rank, some lieutenants could be very junior indeed, while others could be on the cusp of promotion to captain; those lieutenants ranged across present-day army ranks from a second lieutenant through to a lieutenant colonel. Accents in the American South, especially in coastal places like Mobile and Charleston, can still resemble English English quite a bit. instead of "Aren't I?" I tried to sound sympathetic and replied, I am sorry, its been a very busy day and we have no cabbage, would you like to try some broccoli Once again the lady huffed and puffed and repeated now in a very cross tone that suggested the shortage was my fault, I said I wanted a savoy cabbage. ZTdlYmYzMmVjNmE0MjYyNDgxY2E2MjA3OGE5YjU3MWQ3NjQxMzI0MWUwZGU5 ~~~ Why do we still spell it the old way? . Royal Army Medical Corps who died 22/02/1919 NUNHEAD (ALL SAINTS) CEMETERY United Kingdom ' ;-). var mydate=new Date() derrico family names and ages; llano uplift location - from freedictionary.com. It thus seems to be a spelling pronunciation. air force bases in california during wwii. Sub Lieutenant - After one year as a Midshipman, officer cadets are automatically promoted to Sub-Lieutenant. Usage explanations of natural written and spoken English. Apply Now Where will your journey take you? $107.59 + $40.35 shipping. If you believe Wordfence should be allowing you access to this site, please let them know using the steps below so they can investigate why this is happening. dailyinfo[16]=' 22659 Serjeant George SNELL Military Medal "T" Bty. http://thebluelinefrontier.com/ This can be confirmed at Wikitionary. You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. In the United States Navy, promotion to lieutenant is governed by United States Department of Defense policies derived from the Defense Officer Personnel Management Act (DOPMA) of 1980. Websters dictionary only lists Lieutenant. WOW! Both forms, whyever they exist, just happened to stick. A lieutenant was numbered by his seniority within the ship on which he served, so that a frigate (which was entitled to three) would have a first, a second, and a third lieutenant. ODU0OWY0ZTA0ZmIyNDgwYmI3MWViZDFmNDk4MDY2ODRiOWI4MDc5ODgyMWMw The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? There are so many opinions that contradict each other. What are the Physical devices used to construct memories? YzQxODA2MmJmNGEwNTE2NTFjY2Q0NmNlNThkZmFlNTAwMDM5MDQ0NzBjNThh We used Lutenant - or Luatenant, if that is written correct NOT Lootenant as in the American expression or Leftenat, which was considered to be `Army'!!! The British pronunciation was still used in the USA in 1793 but had almost died out except in military circles by 1893. The French don't swap v & u, but their Latin Roman ancestors did; as do the Semites (Phoenicians &/or Hebrews). ant l-ten-nt 1 : an official who acts for a higher official 2 a : first lieutenant b : second lieutenant c : a naval commissioned officer with a rank just below that of lieutenant commander d : a fire or police department officer ranking below a captain More from Merriam-Webster on lieutenant I was always taught - in the '50s - that "left" was army, "loo" was American, and Le'tenant (emphasis on the "ten" )was RN, and therefore right ! What is are the functions of diverse organisms? dailyinfo[7]=' Lieutenant Thomas Sydney Ough DEALY Australian Flying Corps who died 07/03/1918 STONYHURST COLLEGE BURIAL GROUND United Kingdom ' ), from lieu "place" (see lieu) + tenant, present participle of tenir "to hold," from PIE root *ten- "to stretch." The notion is of a "substitute" for higher authority. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. How is lieutenant pronounced in the Royal Navy? (English pronunciations of lieutenant from the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary & Thesaurus and from the Cambridge Academic Content Dictionary, both sources Cambridge University Press), a curve that goes around a central tube or cone shape in the form of a spiral, Watch your back! dailyinfo[19]=' 9228 Corporal George F. PARRY 2nd Bn. I like all different accents from any country - it's interesting to me. 1375 "lutenand" and "That..luf-tenand Was of to the king of Yngland", 1387 "leeftenaunt". About; The Court; Merit Selection; Kansas Values; News; Donate; "lieutenant" "pronunciation" "royal navy" December 12, 2022 by fcs coaches on the hot seat by fcs coaches on the hot seat I, personally, have always pronounced it as lieu - tenant - because it simply makes sense to say it this way. Seaforth Highlanders who died 20/03/1919 BEIRUT WAR CEMETERY Lebanese Republic ' They drop the "f" and say "le-tenant." What is a lieutenant called in England? I think the concept of a person holding place on the left side of his commanding officer has merit; thus the "left" came into it, but only orally. Why does everyone say Colonel as "Kernel" or Coxswain as "Koksin"? I'm still not sure how on earth to pronounce it . However, depending on the branch of the security forces, there may be associated words and abbreviations to consider. But I will offer that an American film viewed with subtitles does bring more symmetry than would one in the Queen's.