Moisture resistant can cause similar problems, and there is absolutely no advantage to it. Additionally, all seams should be sealed with Kerdi Fix and covered with fleece. As a contractor, I have been using Kerdi since it came out. Ratings (91) (5) (91) (3 . Been clankin' away at this computer for a couple of hours now, guys. Why is this the case? Both Kerdi Board and cement board are designed to smooth out uneven spots on the installation surface, create an unbending layer that wont flex underfoot, and also provide a waterproof barrier. Once you have determined the type of thinset, its important to also consider the weather conditions during installation. Yup! It works well, is what Schluter recommends and I've never had an issue with it. Being a Los Angeles resident, Jessica spends a lot of her time looking for her next DIY project and sharing her love for home design. The big issue with cement board is that the thinset will skin over really quickly. It is a fast process that is hard to mess up if you do it right. A mortar wall is better and can be customized easier. Please feel free to reach out to our Product Support Team at 1-800-992-6273 if you need anything. When it comes to applying KERDI, however, it is advised to use a regular thinset that includes portland cement as its main component. Anytime Mongo. Can I put Kerdi board over drywall? Also, apply the acrylic mastic between the Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. By the time you switch from the RG application to the Kerdi installation, it should be dry. Ditra is a 1/8-inch thick polyethylene membrane with a layer of anchoring fleece on the underside and a grid of square cavities on top. The gridlines printed on the surface are beneficial for the installation process, also allowing for quick, neat cuts with a utility knife. Cement board is known to be very heavy and somewhat difficult to cut. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. With Wedi products, the compound curves are easy to produce quickly. Its essential to protect surrounding wall and floor surfaces from water or moisture damage that can occur in these areas. Is a PhD visitor considered as a visiting scholar? It costs more but it;s worth it for the ease of install IMO. Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT is a prefabricated sloped shower tray with integrated Kerdi waterproofing. It is a pliable waterproofing membrane that also doubles as a vapor retarder. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. The thickness of the tile is important, and should be known, but not because it changes the method of building. WATCH HERE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TRLd2HYhbU&list=PLO47JMsdYGrkxM_ZkOc3lMnsVhTqj80bB#justdoityourself #lovingit #p. If there is no blocking behind the seam, i would just tape prior to installing the membrane, the thinset will fill the seam and embed the mesh. I would get someone else. With cement board as a substrate, the key is to ensure proper installation of the membrane. GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. Important to overlap seams in a shingle method. Kerdi Board panels have a number of other advantages: they can be cut to size using an ordinary utility knife, can be glued or screwed into place, and are very lightweight. In order to determine which tile underlayment is right for your project, you need to know which issue youre trying to solve whether its preventing subfloor cracks from transferring to the tile, soundproofing, moisture protection, or providing more rigidity to the tile. I also used the Kerdi drain. As fiber cement board is similar to regular cement board, it makes sense to choose the one that is cheaper or more readily available. Are there tables of wastage rates for different fruit and veg? Kerdi is not a user friendly product, and when you shrink your working time down it is downright stressful. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. Should I use Kerdi membrane or cement backerboard? MAPEI makes products for each step of the remodel process, giving you a single source solution, and only one phone number to call if you need assistance! It's a lightweight polystyrene board faced with Kerdi that comes in various thicknesses that you can use in place of drywall or cement board. I just a few weeks ago put kerdi on top of hardi-board in my shower and it was PAINFUL! What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Will add it in. The surface of Wedi is perfect for bonding. x 5-ft. and 3 x 5-ft. sheets of cement board are sized for efficient use around bathtubs and showers. Once the membrane is in place, it can be sealed and reinforced with Kerdi-Fix sealant, Kerdi band, and Kerdi-Drain for added waterproofing strength. You are telling someone "to have" an artistry that not only takes art skills, knowing how to mix mortar for different situations, and a good amount of practice. Kerdi Board as a whole is much easier to install than Cement Board. Do I have to use Kerdi tape with Ditra membrane? We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. Welcome to the site. Underlayment is designed to smooth out uneven areas of the subfloor and form a rigid layer that prevents the flooring from bending. No, you do not need to install a vapor barrier, as Kerdi Board is the vapor barrier. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[728,90],'remodelormove_com-mobile-leaderboard-2','ezslot_25',167,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-mobile-leaderboard-2-0');Waterproofing should be done prior to the installation of any tile including behind the shower tile. How do you show the depth of a hole in a drawing? Plus, most self-leveling formulas harden very fast, so you have to plan carefully so you can mix and pour quickly. Cement boards are typically capable of withstanding larger amounts of water, while a Schlter system is designed to hold up well only in dry conditions. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. Finally, use a roller or brush to ensure that the membrane is secure and has no wrinkles or air bubbles. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. By: Author Olin Wade (Remodel or Move Stuff). This is necessary to ensure that the membrane will adhere properly to the drywall. That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. If you can paint a wall, you can use RedGard. First, it's super lightweight compared with the rest. Because it can let some moisture wick through it, you have two choices: put a moisture barrier behind it to protect the structure, or, waterproof the front of it. Out of curiosity, why are any of you suggesting backerboard at all? craft paper or plastic is great if the inspector wants it but it is (should be) doing nothing for a tub surround that has HB/redgard/thinset/tile. Well, DH said he had virtually no time to work with the stuff before it dried out, so he switched from my spritz bottle to a sponge. We ended up sponging the Hardi and wetting and booking the Kerdi (a la wallpaper), and that made the installation go much smoother. Fiber cement board is available in 1/4-inch and 1/2-inch thicknesses. The problem is on the back side of the drywall, which is not protected. The Schlter system tends to be more durable than a cement board, but it also depends on the particular application and the weather. Cement board is a good, reliable backer board that works well on both floors and walls. I agree that gypsum seems very questionable anywhere in the wet areas of a shower. There is no cutting or fitting of boards, and a mortar bed is good for leveling and flattening uneven or out-of-level floors, which are common in old houses. 173 upvotes. Is it plausible for constructed languages to be used to affect thought and control or mold people towards desired outcomes? One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. Slap it up comb it out, leave every ridge tall and perfect. I usually use Durock. While cement board is a reliable tile underlayment, it isnt completely waterproof only water-resistant. Additionally, it is important to waterproof cement board before tiling, as the grout and tiles can help keep the board watertight. If you want a cement board, use Durock or Wonderboard. The kerdi membrane will probably do the same, and its regularly installed over drywall which is probably less stable. Installation. Calculating probabilities from d6 dice pool (Degenesis rules for botches and triggers). Once its applied, the last step is to follow up the waterproof coating with a waterproof sealant. RedGard can be used on a wide range of interior and exterior surfaces. With so many different types of underlayment to choose from, it can be hard to decide which is best for your project. To get the most protection from the cement board, it should be installed in a way that ensures it is waterproof, in addition to being secured properly with the right adhesive and screws. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. The manual can be found here: http://floorelf.com/waterproof, I would say unless you are experienced in working with Schluter-Kerdi waterproofing membrane kit, then I would say work with an easier waterproofing approach, either liquid waterproofing or a combination of liquid and traditional waterproofing (plastic covering the wood frame). Various products can be used to waterproof shower walls such as water-resistant drywall and cement backer boards. On a vertical surface, very little moisture . Since the existing wall board will be removed, I'd prefer to go a little extra and install a water proof cement board type base so the tile has a solid substrate even if it were to get wet, such as from a plumbing leak, or from infiltration on an exterior wall (as unlikely as that might be). Cement board is readily available and relatively inexpensive (about $10 for a 3 x 5-ft. sheet). you should still water proof with a liquid membrane product like RedGuard. First Kerdi can be installed on drywall or cement board. Just wondering how effective is the tile on kerdi membrane vs the traditional cement backboard where tiles are glued directly to the drywall? When I tried putting up the first sheets, which were only 36" x 39", and even though I had SOAKED the hardi, to the point water was pooling on the floor, the thinset was already drying before I got the Kerdi up, and I couldn't get it to adhere properly no matter how hard I tried. It also features fleece webbing that allows for effective anchoring into thin-set mortar. Cement board, Wedi board, Kerdi board, Hardibacker, Densshield, Durock, Permabase, or Wonder board . All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried . Contact us: 888-472-4588 Building Panel: Price $ 119 00 $ 202 06 $ 279 00. It's still applied to cement board. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Once this is done, continue the installation by following the directions for the particular Kerdi product being used. Though, each product comes with its own individual characteristics, and pros and cons. Builder saying he doesn't want to put my trim tile in here. Houzz Pro: One simple solution for contractors and design pros, surfer thanked Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Cement board (cbu) is not waterproof, but is not damaged by being wet. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. The perfect fold is tricky and many of my first steam showers where built without the sealed slip joint. Cement board is typically used in wet areas, such as bathrooms and areas with a lot of moisture, because it is waterproof and provides a level of protection from water damage and long-term moisture exposure. rev2023.3.3.43278. See the foam bench and the corners. Can I install Kerdi board just on the walls of my shower and use a PVC membrane on the floor? if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_17',164,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');As an added precaution, you may want to consider to adding a water-resistant layer afterwards, such as a caulking or flashing tape. Kerdi board is a kind of waterproofer because these kinds of boards are made of XPS foam. Retired Moderator - Theatre Guy (and computers). This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. Since KERDI is impervious, it does not deprive the mortar of its moisture. Schluter approves their waterproof Kerdi membrane over drywall. 120 sq feet including the floor. x 33 ft. Waterproofing Membrane: Kerdi-Board 1/2 in. We tried soaking the cement board and applying the kerdi in small sections. KERDI features a modified polyethylene (PEVA) core with non-woven polypropylene on both sides to anchor the membrane in the thin-set mortar. Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. The Kerdi membrane should be applied with the standard procedure, using a hogg brush or a notched trowel to spread the thin-set mortar and a roller to ensure appropriate adhesion. It is designed to form a waterproof layer between cement board and tiles, helping create a watertight installation. Since my guys and I will be doing this for the first time next week, I 'd like to take advantage of your 'learning curve.' I'm thirsty. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. But I did want to understand the cost breakdown as the walls then become WAY more expensive than it would be with Redguard. In general, modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. Kerdi board, on the other hand, is an extruded polystyrene foam panel. Hardi is definitely a "thirsty" substrate but will work, even without a primer of RedGard. Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. Cement board comes both in 1/4-inch-thick and 1/2-inch-thick versions. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[728,90],'remodelormove_com-box-3','ezslot_2',173,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-box-3-0');Yes, you can put Kerdi membrane over cement board. Thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is best for interior projects, but if youre installing outdoors, you should use thinset with a polymer modified (PM) compound for greater moisture resistance. The Kerdi-Line prefab pans and drains make me feel way more comfortable with the waterproofing. Finally, make sure to select a thinset that is appropriate for the job, check the manufacturers recommendation, and always follow the instructions on the product label. Additionally, all thin-set should be allowed to cure for 24 hours before tiles are installed. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. Following these steps will help ensure that your shower space is properly sealed, and thus that the cement board is well protected from moisture.

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